tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post3343581797410969192..comments2011-08-03T08:39:56.433-04:00Z.http://www.blogger.com/profile/14955198622421067159noreply@blogger.comBlogger35125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-74243861177773288582008-01-04T10:55:00.000-05:002008-01-04T10:55:00.000-05:00Well said, Soc. Well said.Z.http://www.blogger.com/profile/14955198622421067159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-60222862107775027582008-01-03T18:22:00.000-05:002008-01-03T18:22:00.000-05:00I guess maybe we should stop dealing with nerdcore the genre and start talking about nerdcore the movement. That really puts things in perspective.antisochttp://antisocial.softcheese.netnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-68760824589225943552008-01-03T12:47:00.000-05:002008-01-03T12:47:00.000-05:00I think that confused a lot of folks, nYg.<BR/><BR/>I think Church and Soc’s tangent brings up an interesting question; if the term “nerdcore” can be applied to nerdy music across the spectrum, would that broaden or narrow the constraints of the term?<BR/><BR/>Thanks for your thoughts, Whompy, and may I mention I’m a big fan. I think your point about a lack of competition is the thing that I most respect about Wrockers. Generally speaking, there are no pissing contests. Moreover, I’ve always believed that the true strength of a scene isn’t just how it treats members, but how it treats outsiders and newcomers. Regarding that, I really think that the Wrock community speaks volumes. <BR/><BR/>Yeah, Anthony, nerdcore is really the only place where these things (ego and whatnot) seem to be such a factor, at least with regard to the geekier side of independent music. And I also agree that we’d probably do better to move this over to the GM4A forums. I’ll not dissuade anyone from posting here, mind you, but that seems like a better place for such a lengthy discourse.<BR/><BR/>Soc, I find your comment about the nebulous nature of nerdcore and Whompy’s about how Wrock’s lack of a unifying genre helps to keep things civil to be an interesting juxtaposition. In that regard, is nerdcore a genre or a mindset?Z.http://www.blogger.com/profile/14955198622421067159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-77362077816007983662008-01-03T11:29:00.000-05:002008-01-03T11:29:00.000-05:00Just another thought I had -- I think another factor that helps wizard rock stay united is that it's not a typical musical genre where style and sound are similar throughout. Wizard rock bands range from rock to metal to folk to electronica to rap, and each style has its own range of influences and skill level. That sort of variety discourages competition, in my opinion. I've personally argued against wizard rock's classification as a "genre"; I see it more as a cultural movement, even a sociopolitical movement, whatever the fuck that means. : )Whompinghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13377463723053780204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-3639997757863704202008-01-03T10:36:00.000-05:002008-01-03T10:36:00.000-05:00Don't get me wrong, I do support scene unity. I rarely ever bad mouth a person, save for critical feedback, and the only time I argue is with people who are causing a division in the scene. I just think that the nebulous definition of what nerdcore is tends to splinter the scene into opposing factions.antisochttp://antisocial.softcheese.netnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-2130546441520494652008-01-03T05:20:00.000-05:002008-01-03T05:20:00.000-05:00Alright, they are up. <A HREF="http://gamemusic4all.proboards92.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=vgmnews&thread=1199355181&page=1" REL="nofollow">THIS LINK TAKES YOU TO THE SPECIFIC THREAD ABOUT THESE COMMENTS</A><BR/><BR/>And this is the link to the main page of my site's forums, the thread can be found in the "Video Game Inspired Music News and Discussion" Board<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://gamemusic4all.proboards92.com/" REL="nofollow">http://gamemusic4all.proboards92.com/</A><BR/><BR/>Like I said before, I hope the conversation can be continued there, but understandable if not, I imagine Z. just has to give the word. Either way, no matter where this conversation takes place i definitely hope it continues!Anthonyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03141348400088728440noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-3694267843971408542008-01-03T04:59:00.000-05:002008-01-03T04:59:00.000-05:00"I think our community is strong because of a few things: 1) There is almost no competition between bands. In fact, we actively strive to help each other out. 2) We really are all a bunch of dorks and misfits who have finally found a place where we fit in. 3) We all love Harry Potter."<BR/><BR/>Except maybe the love of harry potter, I feel like I can say the exact same thing about VG Rock bands. I mean, look at magfest going down as we speak. Every band tries to play, and every band that isn't playing heads down there to support, it's incredible. The same with chiptunes, with Blipfest.<BR/><BR/>I agree with Matt from Whomping WIllows, about people needing to get over all the irrelevant things that intrude on the scenes one is involved in, thing is, i only seem to see this problem with nerdcore, and no where else. I also have gained a lot of respect for the Wrock community, even though I don't think I have ever heard a note of their music! (sorry, I don't read harry potter, or other similar books. Don't beat me up!)<BR/><BR/>Also, agree with nyGel, this has become it's own forum at this point, I wish we could move it somewhere to get more people interested in this discussion and have more people throw their thoughts into the ring. Talking all this out, and getting these problems out there I think, is a good way to start solving these problems. I mean, how can we fix problems without discussing them, then coming up with a course of action. Like antisoc stating some problems, then throwing out the idea of a mentoring program to help solve those problems.<BR/><BR/>I also agree with z that the strength and weakness of nerdcore is that it's open to everyone. it's sort of the same in the chiptunes scene. there are a ton of people making chiptunes, but many of them are not really contributing anything to move the scene forward, and actually may hurt the scene by sounding similar and mediocre, which causes the chiptune stereotype of "anyone can make chiptunes."<BR/><BR/>I think what antisoc said about a kind of "Nerdcore statement of faith" could cause a split in the nerdcore community, sort of in the way that there is a split in the VG remix community due to the fact that OCRemix judges every song that comes into their site, where as VGMix allows Pretty much everyone to remix songs however they please. A split in nerdcore may be necessary perhaps though, but I could never difinitebely say, but at this point I think it would be best for nerdcore to abnd together despite how "nerdcore" they are. I do think that there is a kind of unsaid understanding of what nerdcore is though, even if it is very broad and ill-defined.<BR/><BR/>Also, I am going to toss this conversation we have had so far in my websites forums. perhaps the discussion can be continued there? Understandable if you guys want to keep posting here though, just want to throw the option out there, since I suggested it. (i'm taking action on my idea!) I'd toss it in rhyme torrents, but I am afraid of more uncivil reactions there.Anthonyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03141348400088728440noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-7706642138374186622008-01-03T00:38:00.000-05:002008-01-03T00:38:00.000-05:00i think we all has egos as well. yep. that adds a bit too.<BR/><BR/>this is practically a forum at this point.Nygelhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14874455529212473000noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-51727828882137609922008-01-03T00:25:00.000-05:002008-01-03T00:25:00.000-05:00Hey everyone, it's Matt from The Whomping Willows. Bradley from Draco and the Malfoys linked me to this post. I just wanted to say a couple things in response. First, I'm glad to see that the wizard rock scene gets respect from other communities for its DIY ethics and overall strength as a community. We work extremely hard to keep wizard rock free from corporate involvement, and one major reason for that is that we'd love to see these 350+ bands maintain DIY ethics throughout their musical careers and contribute to the development of a generation of musicians who reject the traditional label/band formula. Most of the "bigger" wizard rock bands have been part of a local music scene for several years before wizard rock was in existence, and we've had these ethics intact from the beginning. Personally, I've been signed to a small "DIY" indie label, and even that led to artistic compromises that I now regret. I am of the firm belief that no band needs a record label to get by. It's not terribly difficult to convince these kids of that, because all one has to do is point to Harry and the Potters as an example of a band that's become very successful while maintaining a truly DIY approach. Anyway. I think our community is strong because of a few things: 1) There is almost no competition between bands. In fact, we actively strive to help each other out. 2) We really are all a bunch of dorks and misfits who have finally found a place where we fit in. 3) We all love Harry Potter. 4) For whatever reason, most of us share similar political views and we invest a lot of time and money into charitable causes.<BR/><BR/>I always assumed that the wizard rock bubble would burst at some point, but I've yet to encounter any evidence that it's going to happen soon. Against all odds, my fall tour was more successful than my summer tour, and I'm planning to spend 6 to 7 months on the road in 2008. It's incredible. If I could offer any advice to any other communities, I'd simply say that in order to make it work collectively, you just have to get over all of the petty bullshit that typically accompanies a scene. That includes worrying about terminology, worrying about newcomers and their skill level, any form of competition, and any sense of entitlement on the part of bigger or older bands. That stuff is simply irrelevant -- at the end of the day, what matters most is the music you make, the message you convey, and the effect it has on the people who listen to it.<BR/><BR/>Sincerely,<BR/>MattWhompinghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13377463723053780204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-76423397863635203952008-01-03T00:18:00.000-05:002008-01-03T00:18:00.000-05:00church: I was just presenting the 50 Cent example for the sake of argument, I really don't agree with that either.<BR/><BR/>If you go to a (pardon me) church or other religious institution, you can usually find a "statement of faith" posted somewhere. If nerdcore required something similar, like answering the question "in what way are you a nerd?" I think there would probably be fewer problems. If you have problems answering that question, maybe you should look into other musical avenues. This is <I>NERD</I>core after allantisocantisocial.softcheese.netnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-68362644170858429932008-01-02T22:38:00.000-05:002008-01-02T22:38:00.000-05:00Hate to disagree with AntiSoc, but: "Heck, if 50 cent started to claim to be nerdcore, he would be nerdcore. "<BR/><BR/>No. Barring a serious style change, not anymore than MC Chip's claims that he *isn't* make it any more so. (Although it's more arguable than the former.)<BR/><BR/>There is a definition of nerdcore (though it's interesting that people like JoCo et al. are getting that label, minus the "hip-hop") and although it would be interesting if people started to try to co-opt it (!) it's pretty easy to sort out.<BR/><BR/>OK, not really contributing much beyond an observation...Churchhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12793960528548962421noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-45878351765704534622008-01-02T22:36:00.000-05:002008-01-02T22:36:00.000-05:00my opinion of nerdcore is hip-hop in style with influences either by nerd culture or the artist is generally considered to eb in the nerd culture. which is why when chris said he wasn't nerdcore then released a track called nrrd girl it confused the hell out of me.Nygelhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14874455529212473000noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-4333534275998856772008-01-02T14:49:00.000-05:002008-01-02T14:49:00.000-05:00yeah, Z, I try not to think about it.antisocnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-8617004018456865122008-01-02T13:20:00.000-05:002008-01-02T13:20:00.000-05:00I find it interesting, Matt, that while everyone likes to talk about how the mainstream has been changed by the "radical" underground ideas that have been fostered by the Internet, few think about the other side of that coin. <BR/><BR/>Yeah, Soc, nerdcore is nebulous at best. It's strength is that it's genuinely open to anyone, but that's also a weakness.Z.http://www.blogger.com/profile/14955198622421067159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-37636871785314193982008-01-02T12:17:00.000-05:002008-01-02T12:17:00.000-05:00To change the topic a little, I prefer "Nerd Rap" because a lot of Nerdcore is really not all that "nerd", nor is it all that "core". I think a lot of the problems in nerdcore could be eliminated with some subgenres with requirements, simply because it's so broad a category, and anyone who claims to be nerdcore *is* nerdcore (at least that's the popular consensus). Heck, if 50 cent started to claim to be nerdcore, he would be nerdcore. That really bothers me. I think it bothers me more because there isn't a really good definition of what nerdcore really is. For an example, surf rock. It's generally about surfing and the surfer lifestyle, and they have certain guitar sounds, amp settings, and vocal harmonies that are somewhat genre specific. Nerdcore has two requirements: it has to be rap and you have to call yourself nerdcore, which really doesn't differentiate it at all from rap. I guess the point is that asking "what is nerdcore?" is like opening a can of worms that eat your soul.antisocnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-14837762646145594572008-01-02T11:52:00.000-05:002008-01-02T11:52:00.000-05:00I think it has a home in punk, it just isn't the defining idea that people used to think it was. Emphasis on 'think'. Go back all the way to the start and there have always been band's that made no bones about their wanting success. And even more that wanted success, but were afraid to admit it because of the backlash.<BR/><BR/>When the way Billboard counts holiday returns resulted in Nirvana having a hit though, punk began to loose the innocence that allowed it to pretend that DIY was a defining force behind the scene. With the lose of that innocence, groups felt less compelled to play along if they didn't want to.<BR/><BR/>This doesn't mean the idea has been abandoned though, at the moment it is just a little harder to find. You've got to dig a little deeper into the underground, but the work is usually rewarded with some great finds.<BR/><BR/>The more interesting thing in my mind is that while the idea has lost momentum in the punk scene, it has gained momentum everywhere else. I've said before that the thing that really piqued my interest in the WRock scene was where this kids go from here, now that they have been directly exposed to DIY. Many will treat this as a phase that they'll eventually grow out of, but some of these kids will be forever changed by what they've learned in the WRock community.<BR/><BR/>I've long held that the over arching effect that the internet has had on our culture is the mainstreaming of previously underground ideas. The process has had an interesting effect though on the underground.<BR/><BR/>While the mainstream is being infected with underground ideas, the underground is being infected with mainstream ideas. This is resulting in the line between these two cultures blurring even more then before. Push past the crust of the underground though and really get into the guts of it and the heart is still pumping strong.Matthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09687165120949107688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-44920655593475352912008-01-02T10:48:00.000-05:002008-01-02T10:48:00.000-05:00Yeah, nYgel, one of the things I found most impressive about your mixtape was that you were really the driving force; you wanted to make something so you took the initiative and did it. And I’m still enjoying it BTW. :)<BR/><BR/>Thanks for the love in your wrap-up, Anthony. The feeling is most definitely mutual. Yeah, there are a handful of cats out there who really put a lot into a scene but don’t see much of a return. That’s why I see blogs like ours as an important outlet. Many times we might note something that would otherwise slip through the cracks. And I think those are some excellent choices for places for nYgel to explore other scenes!<BR/><BR/>Thanks for helping me out with the inspiration for this, Luzid! Z1 is another excellent example of someone who’s not afraid to get his hands dirty. Though he’s still a relative newcomer (to the nerdcore scene, but certainly not rap) he really does a lot to help elevate.<BR/><BR/>Soc, I’m really glad to see you working with Shawn and vPn. I think collabs like that – partnerships of open-minded and creatively inclined people bereft of egos and genuinely interested in honing their skills – is truly what nerdcore needs. <BR/><BR/>Matt, you always make excellent points. Do you think the old school punk rock ethic even has a home in punk anymore? It seems to me like most modern scenes are just too wrapped up in “making it big” to put in that kind of effort.Z.http://www.blogger.com/profile/14955198622421067159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-55601357668855013532008-01-02T02:23:00.000-05:002008-01-02T02:23:00.000-05:00@ nygel<BR/><BR/>You can check out theshizz.org and hit the minibosses forum for VG rock and remixes. ocremix.org for video game remixes of course. and thasauce.net for all sorts of video game inspired music. Hope that helps!Anthonyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03141348400088728440noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-35744740467528778452008-01-01T22:57:00.000-05:002008-01-01T22:57:00.000-05:00alright, just curious, cuz i enjoy this shit, what other communities could i dip into? most of you are familiar with me so where could i go? I know RT but what other forums are around? i really do want to check them out.Nygelhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14874455529212473000noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-77712945476249482162008-01-01T20:58:00.000-05:002008-01-01T20:58:00.000-05:00@ Matt<BR/><BR/>I never noticed the VG inspired music scene being underrepresented, but maybe it depends on the perspective you are looking at it from. I may have not noticed because I am right in the thick of it. I would definitely love to discuss the issue with you though, and see what can be done. Just hit me up whenever you have the time. Anything to promote the VGIM scene =DAnthonyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03141348400088728440noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-51173855456383747932008-01-01T18:45:00.000-05:002008-01-01T18:45:00.000-05:00Anthony, glad to hear that you dig SSS, once I can get things kick started again (probably late Jan/early Feb now) I'm definitely going to be contacting you. I'm pretty ashamed of how poorly represented the whole video game related scene is being represented and I'd like to brainstorm with you over ways to correct that.Matthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09687165120949107688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-12120741018290481012008-01-01T18:39:00.000-05:002008-01-01T18:39:00.000-05:00Soc, glad to hear it! I agree that something like that is vital.<BR/><BR/>nYgel, my comments weren't directed specifically at you and soc, but to everyone. You guys just happened to be the most obvious examples to use since you'd posted before I did and both of you had very cool ideas. <BR/><BR/>Z and I had a conversation back in early '07 about how the punk DIY spirit, which has had a huge influence in our lives, seemed to be lacking in the nerdcore scene. The challenge is basically an attempt to light that fire in people. Now, may be that conversation, and hence the challenge itself, is now out of date or may be I'm just preaching to the choir here, I don't know. Like I said before, I'm very much an outsider in the nerdcore scene, but it is something that I'm very interested in seeing succeed for various reasons.<BR/><BR/>You comment, nYgel, about only having so many uncleared samples is something that occurred to me after I posted that message. I was thinking less of a mix tape though, and more of a straight up comp. One of the things I liked about your mix tape was that it wasn't just the obvious choices, but featured a lot of folks that I hadn't really heard before. May be that's just because I'm on the outside in this, but from the point of view of promoting nerdcore, something like that is very important. Plus, a regular series of comps like that would pretty much turn you into a legend in the scene. :)<BR/><BR/>I'm not sure how much work a project like that would entail, having never done it. And I definitely understand how you could be to busy to really under take something like that and would prefer to focus on your own music. I'm just tossing out ideas though. After posting my previous comment, my little slight of hand trick there where I challenged you guys to do something and then excused myself from that challenge didn't sit right with me. So, I've decided to try and come up with some ideas of my own as well that I'm bouncing of Church and Z. This comment is just me riffing off what you guys said in hopes of may be generating some additional activity.<BR/><BR/>Well, that and procrastinating the crap for work that I've put off all weekend, but need to do before I go back to work tomorrow.Matthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09687165120949107688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-81691845883315620562008-01-01T17:24:00.000-05:002008-01-01T17:24:00.000-05:00P.S. props to tanner, who offered to let me record in his studio if I needed it.antisocnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-44190028105103679912008-01-01T17:21:00.000-05:002008-01-01T17:21:00.000-05:00matt: currently, I've been collaborating with newcomers Shawn Who and also 73hvpn (or will be collaborating, I should say...), although I consider myself somewhat of a newcomer to the scene<BR/><BR/>Also, I'm either up for mentoring someone or being mentored myself. I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is.antisocnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15042066.post-23836366670368549522008-01-01T04:55:00.000-05:002008-01-01T04:55:00.000-05:00First off - Z, great post!<BR/><BR/>Antisoc, great reply as well. Here's my take: "Noobs who don't try to improve" and "noobs who don't realize how bad they sound" are directly responsible for the other half of your first two bullet points.<BR/><BR/>I can speak to firsthand experience about how a mentor, or even just some friendly advice in an ear willing to improve, can make a world of difference. ZeaLous1 was the first person to ever hear anything I did (my first song, LBL). It was rough, and needed work, but he saw the potential.<BR/><BR/>Go forward a couple of months, after some helpful tips from him, and I'm onstage at his show. The audience loved the track, and for good reason - people like him make people like me want to bust our asses the way I did to improve. Since that first encouragement in May, I've released a few songs, been played on the radio and gotten raves about my flow from a few people on the street - all because the work improved. Ego's killing too many half-baked nerd rappers' chance to step up their game.<BR/><BR/>There are some nerdcore rappers that think they're way better than they are, and no amount of mentoring will improve their work (they don't see why their work is, well, not working). But for those who don't think that way (a majority, I suspect), your idea makes a lot of sense.Luzidhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15862297674415830596noreply@blogger.com